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New Dayton Signature Series (Sub180-4 etc)
in DIY
Hello all , being new here to this forum , not sure about managing the outdated(?) interface!
Is there any info when these new dayton drivers are being available?
Greetings from germany .. bye
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I don't know when, but they are only $50
Going by PE's past pricing. That may be an introductory number to get some product moving and reviews posted. Then may shoot up something like 30% for the long run. And every once in a while it will go on sale for the introductory price.
oops. did I say the quiet part loud?
You are likely correct.
It is plausibly accurate, because Bryan said they get a faster turnaround at the build house for them. This may save money for both PE and the consumer for the Sig series.
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It also depends on how they are positioning the Signature Series, especially relative to the Reference Series. $50 would put it as "slightly" more budget friendly than RS.
Also, while PE "tried" to increase some prices during the 2021/22 supply-chain issues, many of those are back to where they started, which goes back to a recent post of mine about price taking behavior in competitive markets.
I think that is where it is supposed to fall in hierarchy.
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Hopefully doesn't follow that Esoteric series. I didn't quite understand it. It may have been good on distortion (don't know) but the price vs the low efficiency immediately turned me off.
Watts are sooooo cheap anymore, that efficiency generally is a secondary concern.
Unless you are over on diyaudio
I messed with the 4" and 5.25" in WinISD for a few minutes. Seemed tough to design a box where they won't get into overexcursion at too high frequency. For the 5.25" I had some difficulty getting a tune to not blow past xmax above 40hz at 15watts. Maybe I just suck at WinISD.
Your probably doing it right. I checked some past models I did for RS150 (4.4mm xmax) and SB15NRX2 (5mm xmax) and SIG150 (4mm xmax) and they all pretty much hit xmax with 15 watts, at least in the models that I have saved.
If PE are going to respawn the Peerless series, why not take the opportunity to improve it by putting a copper sleeve in it?
Tymphany does this for their big customers eg. upgrade an affordable line like SLS with a better motor and bring the higher order HD by 10+ dB
That would probably directly compete with their own reference series then. As somewhat alluded to above.
Your models are correct, but I personally model to an SPL level, which changes things. Usually only takes a few watts to hit 90db. That is still louder than I typically listen, and louder than we set levels at DIY get togethers.
High inductance for a 4 ohm driver. Excellent FR for an aluminum cone. I'd rather they slap a better motor on it and place it a step above the Reference line at $100-120, rather than a step below. Any of Dayton's attempts at a real high end driver have been a bit too ambitious and over the top. Visually I'm not a fan of the bowl style cone without dustcap, makes it looks really out of place if you are mixing multiple drivers in a build IMO. Images shown imply an 8" model which will be nice.
Should be 5 sizes all in.
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Do you know if they will be adding 8-ohm versions as well?
I think Bryan said they will. Memory is a little fuzzy about that though.
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That picture could be Charlie's MWAF entry
Nah, that's definitely a Neubecker design😛
I wonder whether there will be a tweeter or two coming.
Bryan did not mention any tweeters in the Signature Series.
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They would be missing out on a chance to beat up on that new RS tweeter.
Yeah, Dayton Audio really needs to up their game on tweeters above $45. SBA probably has 20 good-for-the money tweeters between $40 and $75.
I have asked for a better tweeter, it falls on deaf ears. Pun intended.
I asked Bryan at the 2019 MWAF if Dayton Audio had any plans of making a higher end 3/4 inch tweeter. He said it was not going to happen - not even thinking about it. I understand they discovered that the profit margin if better on larger drivers. The new Sig180-4 probably costs $3 more to make vs the Sig120-4 but the sig180-4 sells for $20 more. Maybe the profit margin is too low on small tweeters and there may not be enough demand to go up against all the smaller tweeters already on the market. They could save some money on development if they used some of the parts from the Tymphany (Peerless) NE19 series that are no longer available to DIYers. Last year Scanspeak created new versions of the D2008/2010 series tweeters that have been around for over 40 years. I really like the better dispersion of smaller tweeters; but to make them integrate into a high end design they need to be able to crossover <2.5khz 2nd over with very low distortion. On way to accomplish this is to offer a tweeter without a faceplate that can be used with a waveguide - Dayton Audio could offer a waveguide as a separate part which would create an accessory part to make more money selling. I found a pair of Peerless NE19VTT-04 tweeters on E-bay and have a pair coming in the mail today. I'm curious how a 3/4 inch titanium dome would sound - I never heard one.
It seemed Peerless was trying with the DX20BF00-04. I saw over at ampslab he liked it enough to try in multiple configs. It looks like he was able to cross it down ~2.5k but I believe he is using active 24db/octave. From reading around I get the consensus 12db/octave would need bumped up toward 3k. Seems maintaining linear displacement is the issue with smaller domes.
. . . or much lower SPL application as the XO point is reduced in freq.