@tktran said:
Looks like they’ve respawned a driver series just to fill the holes left by Tymphany.
I’m looking elsewhere
I am waiting to see how these "new" drivers perform - I think it depends on which Tymphany/Peerless product line is being emulated. For example, I have used four Peerless 830869 (cast frame 8" HDS line with nomex cone) and these worked well for me, but sadly unless I want to buy 500pcs they are NLA. I would love it if the new Dayton 8" driver is similar. OTOH if they are emulating the Peerless SLS line I will take a pass.
If you’re going to respawn a line; may as well improve on it. Make it as good (or better) than the HDS Exclusive line. And get rid if that silver basket/phase plug.
The 830869 has low distortion around 100Hz, good sensitivity, a very open basket, and was inexpensive for what it brought to the table. Since I needed four per side, it fit the bill nicely.
@Shawn_K said:
... I found a pair of Peerless NE19VTT-04 tweeters on E-bay and have a pair coming in the mail today. I'm curious how a 3/4 inch titanium dome would sound - I never heard one.
In this application they sound very nice. Granted, I use these in an intimate listening environment and not to ROCK the BLOCK.
I thought they looked great at AXPONA too.
What you don't know yet, is that the Sig will appear in Dayton's kits in the near future. The in house kits and home audio speakers will now use the same drive units as their DIY offerings. Kits et al will be supposedly making a huge step up.
I received my SIG180-4's Thursday and burned them in overnight with a 40hz sine wave.
Here are TS parameters and impedance from a DATS v3.
Next are box simulations with volume at 0.70 cf assuming Qa=50 and Series Resistance 0.40ohms. Green is MFG parameters tuned to 39hz. Red and Blue are measured parameters tuned to 40hz.
Below is SPL at 30watts, where they reach xmax. I only show this because the transfer function scale seems to exaggerate the difference.
Based on the mfg specs I was hoping to maybe squeeze them into 0.56 cf boxes but I think I'll need to go bigger. I think 0.60 or 0.65 cf would work but my reuseable/prototype cabinets jump from 0.56 to 0.73 gross.
@Wolf said:
I thought they looked great at AXPONA too.
What you don't know yet, is that the Sig will appear in Dayton's kits in the near future. The in house kits and home audio speakers will now use the same drive units as their DIY offerings. Kits et al will be supposedly making a huge step up.
Copyright your names now, or prepare to have them swiped.
I think the Dayton budget tweets are ok for the $ - the “ND’s” - remember when they were $5 or $6 on sale? Anyway, the old RSA and F seemed well regarded- I only did one build using the “F” and thought it was a really nice. Seems like, for whatever reason the replacement “RST” which is cheaper than the original RS and that PE calls a “upgrade” just hasn’t gained acceptance. I have no experience at all with these units. I would suspect these to be the tweets that might show up in a kit with the SIGS. And then the “Esoteric” that didn’t last long at all - was that a patent issue and they had to pull it?
@tommytunes50 said:
I think the Dayton budget tweets are ok for the $ - the “ND’s” - remember when they were $5 or $6 on sale? Anyway, the old RSA and F seemed well regarded- I only did one build using the “F” and thought it was a really nice. Seems like, for whatever reason the replacement “RST” which is cheaper than the original RS and that PE calls a “upgrade” just hasn’t gained acceptance. I have no experience at all with these units. I would suspect these to be the tweets that might show up in a kit with the SIGS. And then the “Esoteric” that didn’t last long at all - was that a patent issue and they had to pull it?
I don't know what caused it but SBA and PE are mortal enemies and it seems like this fight will go on forever. To be honest we better all hope they never make amends.
@DrewsBrews said:
I messed with the 4" and 5.25" in WinISD for a few minutes. Seemed tough to design a box where they won't get into overexcursion at too high frequency. For the 5.25" I had some difficulty getting a tune to not blow past xmax above 40hz at 15watts. Maybe I just suck at WinISD.
Your models are correct, but I personally model to an SPL level, which changes things. Usually only takes a few watts to hit 90db. That is still louder than I typically listen, and louder than we set levels at DIY get togethers.
I'm in exactly the same camp. My target is about 95 dB. If the modeling does not support that, then I usually scrap or modify the design plan. The combination of our ears' sensitivity curve and the distortion curve of smallish midwoofers at low frequencies means that a lot of midwoofers found in two way speakers are farting out some representation of bass that may or may not have much correlation to what is actually heard in a live performance. Over the years, I have moved from shooting for a low Fs to shooting for a bass alignment that allows for a reasonable level of fidelity over the bandwidth designed for.
Keep an open mind, but don't let your brain fall out.
Comments
Looks like they’ve respawned a driver series just to fill the holes left by Tymphany.
I’m looking elsewhere
I am waiting to see how these "new" drivers perform - I think it depends on which Tymphany/Peerless product line is being emulated. For example, I have used four Peerless 830869 (cast frame 8" HDS line with nomex cone) and these worked well for me, but sadly unless I want to buy 500pcs they are NLA. I would love it if the new Dayton 8" driver is similar. OTOH if they are emulating the Peerless SLS line I will take a pass.
If you’re going to respawn a line; may as well improve on it. Make it as good (or better) than the HDS Exclusive line. And get rid if that silver basket/phase plug.
@charlielaub
What do you like about the 830869?
The XXLS line is what I’m going to miss the most…
The 830869 has low distortion around 100Hz, good sensitivity, a very open basket, and was inexpensive for what it brought to the table. Since I needed four per side, it fit the bill nicely.
In this application they sound very nice. Granted, I use these in an intimate listening environment and not to ROCK the BLOCK.
Piccolata
@charlielaub
Why would you take a pass if it was like SLS?
Here's the SLS 8" in 3/4cu ft cabinet:
https://diy.midwestaudio.club/discussion/2108/sls-830667-as-a-woofer-in-a-3-way
Usable to 300-400Hz.
Similar distortion to 830869 ~100Hz, and whilst the SLS8 has more excursion, it has lower sensitivity and is more suited for sealed boxes.
To me the SLS is equally good (or bad) as non-Exclusive HDS...
As the prices for the RS225/RS270 went up, they are ones to beat in the value for money stakes
My pair of -180 arrived today. Build quality is excellent. Very good looking driver.
I thought they looked great at AXPONA too.
What you don't know yet, is that the Sig will appear in Dayton's kits in the near future. The in house kits and home audio speakers will now use the same drive units as their DIY offerings. Kits et al will be supposedly making a huge step up.
InDIYana Event Website
Wolfy's Photobucket
Well, good for PE. Hopefully their in-house design takes a similar step up, as well.
JR with the savage punches tonight. Not that I disagree with him.
I received my SIG180-4's Thursday and burned them in overnight with a 40hz sine wave.
Here are TS parameters and impedance from a DATS v3.
Next are box simulations with volume at 0.70 cf assuming Qa=50 and Series Resistance 0.40ohms. Green is MFG parameters tuned to 39hz. Red and Blue are measured parameters tuned to 40hz.
Below is SPL at 30watts, where they reach xmax. I only show this because the transfer function scale seems to exaggerate the difference.
Based on the mfg specs I was hoping to maybe squeeze them into 0.56 cf boxes but I think I'll need to go bigger. I think 0.60 or 0.65 cf would work but my reuseable/prototype cabinets jump from 0.56 to 0.73 gross.
Copyright your names now, or prepare to have them swiped.
I figure as long as they are using Dayton Audio tweeters, the world of kits is safe.
I use to love the Silky’s but I think they should have called them the Sticky’s.
I think the Dayton budget tweets are ok for the $ - the “ND’s” - remember when they were $5 or $6 on sale? Anyway, the old RSA and F seemed well regarded- I only did one build using the “F” and thought it was a really nice. Seems like, for whatever reason the replacement “RST” which is cheaper than the original RS and that PE calls a “upgrade” just hasn’t gained acceptance. I have no experience at all with these units. I would suspect these to be the tweets that might show up in a kit with the SIGS. And then the “Esoteric” that didn’t last long at all - was that a patent issue and they had to pull it?
Yes, they pissed off SBA.
I still have a set of those in the kick panels of the Saturn.
Are you able to elaborate more on this?
I don't know what caused it but SBA and PE are mortal enemies and it seems like this fight will go on forever. To be honest we better all hope they never make amends.
Sure, PE had their knockoff ring radiator Esoteric tweeter and SBA took exception to it.
I'm in exactly the same camp. My target is about 95 dB. If the modeling does not support that, then I usually scrap or modify the design plan. The combination of our ears' sensitivity curve and the distortion curve of smallish midwoofers at low frequencies means that a lot of midwoofers found in two way speakers are farting out some representation of bass that may or may not have much correlation to what is actually heard in a live performance. Over the years, I have moved from shooting for a low Fs to shooting for a bass alignment that allows for a reasonable level of fidelity over the bandwidth designed for.
Sehlin Sound Solutions
AFAIK Dayton infringed on SBA's dimple dome tweeter patent. And SBA kindly informed Dayton of their mistake.
The pin-dome was not enough of a departure from the dimple.
InDIYana Event Website
Wolfy's Photobucket
So I ordered a pair of the 5" Signature Dayton woofers. I'm going to whip out a design using the Dayton waveguide tweeters and call it the "D-Note"
You heard it here first.
Why not Cignet?
InDIYana Event Website
Wolfy's Photobucket
Could I call my super cheap project using those $5 buyout tweeters the "B-Notes"?
How about "B-roll"
For some reason the tweeter is giving me old plastic camera vibes now.
How about an update on this project?
Why didn't you butt flats?
InDIYana Event Website
Wolfy's Photobucket