Yes indeed, HiVi TN25. I've wanted to try it for years based on wolf's and Jhollander's positive views but didn't like the looks and didn't want to mess with mounting the square frame. Build thread with Mac-05 to be posted in several weeks.
It's a sweet sounding little tweeter. Jim Griffin's Aura NS3/TN25 MTM TL sticks were a great design with them back in the day. He used craft foam to flush in the face and cover the NS3 frames. F3 was high 30s.
Not really that new, but Parts Express started selling "Sonic Barrier" denim sound dampening material. When I ordered last month they were out of the 30mm thick (40" x 55" for $35) so I ordered the 50 mm thick (40" x 48" for $60). I have some Frost King insulation from Amazon which is a cheap denim insulation for insulating pipes or whatever around the house, 1" thick (not) 16" x 48" for $14.
Sorry, my phone didn't focus on the ruler, but you can see that the Sonic Barrier is pretty much 2" thick and the Frost king is at best 1/2" thick.
@PWRRYD said:
Looks very nice but costs more than I usually spend on a single driver LOL!
That's fair, I just wanted to post a pic that it is nice quality stuff. For a two-way I would probably go with the 30mm, they just happened to be out of stock when I was ordering. I'd also think for the $35 of the 30mm it would be enough for 3 pair of two ways.
I scavenged some stuff that looks nearly the same when my wife ordered some high-end frozen food. It was sealed in thin white plastic bags. I can't imagine it cost the food company much. I've looked around on the net to see if there's a source, but haven't found anything except the Ultra Touch.
Second Skin Audio sells cotton fiber panels. It's nice stuff but I think the PE panels were less money the last time I looked. Cotton fiber works well and is much less money than acoustic foam. I use cotton everywhere except for panels that I need to make cutouts for drivers because the foam is much easier to cut.
@Tom_S said:
I scavenged some stuff that looks nearly the same when my wife ordered some high-end frozen food. It was sealed in thin white plastic bags. I can't imagine it cost the food company much. I've looked around on the net to see if there's a source, but haven't found anything except the Ultra Touch.
Like Tom I have received it with frozen food that we bought online and over the course of several years refused to toss any of it out. I think I'm set for life....
I tried to locate a vendor, but didn't get far.
I have the receivers save that stuff when people use it to pack their returns. I also score a lot of egg crate foam pieces too. Quite the perk of working there.
The thin plastic over the denim stuff does break down after sitting for a few years. Makes a real mess, so I strip it off as soon as I get it home now.
I'm sorry, but no it is not.
$800 is a great price for something like this completed so a profit can be made.
Going from driver retail costs...
100 + 100 + 35 + 35 + 35 + 35 + 38 + 38 = 416
The cabinets are prefinished, but supposedly cheaper than the precut knockdown cabs would have been. Even if I say $100 for the mdf, the finish adds likely another $50-100 of cost for most of us to finish a set of cabs.
If you then add in the design time and R&D, that $616 will hit that $800 pretty quickly.
This is a commercial product, and has to make a profit upon sale. I see this way too often that commercial products could be made for much less, but when you figure in the overhead and time being money (labor), you have to include it. Free labor is only applicable if you do it yourself.
I know the 1TDX is close in price. I see the performance is similar in room, save for sensitivity. However, I also see that the OPAL1 is already a finished cabinet, and actually physically smaller. The 1TDX will still require your labor and money to veneer or paint, as well as assembly. The 1TDX has farmed out the labor to the builder.
Seems like the woofers are DA's response to the Purifi "throw down", and they may be quite good.
No FR measurement or THD shown, which makes me suspicious. Want to see ASR run Klippel on these.
The dude in the video is quite a salesman.
I built a 1TDX pair for a friend a couple of years ago, and they were much better than I had heard from any Dayton drivers, and the crossover was a joy to listen to. Pretty tough to top that.
But Chahly - Stahkist don't want speakers that look good, Stahkist wants speakers that sound good!
Matt has been with PE for as long as I can remember. He was one of the judges at MWAF 2017. He really seems to know the ins and outs of good loudspeaker design. Here is a picture of him in 2017 on the right side of the judging table next to the other two judges (Tom P. and Jerry M.)
Wolf, I have already acknowledged that it is not apples to apples. The 1TDX is still a commercial offering with all of the design work, retail, and R&D costs factored in. The only thing not included is the cabinet. We don't know the quality of the OPAL1 crossover components, considering that the crossover is not touted as a feature the quality is probably meh. I know Matt P. can design a good speaker. I'm not convinced that this 2 way is the best application for the woofer (distortion peek at 1k), and the tweeter has a rocky history. For me, OPAL1 is hard to get excited about. It feels like they forced their "best" components in a box.
Their yet to be released signature series powered speakers have me more intrigued than the OPAL1. Their "reimagined" B52 looks like it is an extremely high value.
Yes, the TDX has a lot of the same costs factored into place, I thought that was understood.
The xover parts are likely stock Dayton parts, or the cost would have been even higher. No illusions there. Matt did a good job with what was used.
I acknowledge the RST checkered past and the rise the E150 has in HD. I won't be using my pair that high. I did not find that they sounded bad though. Did they make a structured "boy band" speaker from their lineup, kinda did. I did not see the "new B52", as I was only briefly in the room.
Not really disagreeing with anything here. Just that it is worth the cost.
Comments
Cool. Looks like a TN25
Beat me to it
HiVi TN25?
Yes indeed, HiVi TN25. I've wanted to try it for years based on wolf's and Jhollander's positive views but didn't like the looks and didn't want to mess with mounting the square frame. Build thread with Mac-05 to be posted in several weeks.
A4e - are you going to cross these at around 3KHz?
That was my original plan but I ended up right at 2.5khz (LR4). Small chance that this will change, but probably not.
https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-CE81PF-8-3-Full-Range-15W-8-ohm-285-179?quantity=1
Would make for a good budget midrange, I think. Flat response and a low price.
It's a sweet sounding little tweeter. Jim Griffin's Aura NS3/TN25 MTM TL sticks were a great design with them back in the day. He used craft foam to flush in the face and cover the NS3 frames. F3 was high 30s.
InDIYana Event Website
Not really that new, but Parts Express started selling "Sonic Barrier" denim sound dampening material. When I ordered last month they were out of the 30mm thick (40" x 55" for $35) so I ordered the 50 mm thick (40" x 48" for $60). I have some Frost King insulation from Amazon which is a cheap denim insulation for insulating pipes or whatever around the house, 1" thick (not) 16" x 48" for $14.
Sorry, my phone didn't focus on the ruler, but you can see that the Sonic Barrier is pretty much 2" thick and the Frost king is at best 1/2" thick.
Nick bought the vinyl backed stuff for his Raal/Morel/Usher 3-way. Nice stuff.
Looks very nice but costs more than I usually spend on a single driver LOL!
That's fair, I just wanted to post a pic that it is nice quality stuff. For a two-way I would probably go with the 30mm, they just happened to be out of stock when I was ordering. I'd also think for the $35 of the 30mm it would be enough for 3 pair of two ways.
I scavenged some stuff that looks nearly the same when my wife ordered some high-end frozen food. It was sealed in thin white plastic bags. I can't imagine it cost the food company much. I've looked around on the net to see if there's a source, but haven't found anything except the Ultra Touch.
Second Skin Audio sells cotton fiber panels. It's nice stuff but I think the PE panels were less money the last time I looked. Cotton fiber works well and is much less money than acoustic foam. I use cotton everywhere except for panels that I need to make cutouts for drivers because the foam is much easier to cut.
https://secondskinaudio.com/acoustics/ecoverb
Ron
Like Tom I have received it with frozen food that we bought online and over the course of several years refused to toss any of it out. I think I'm set for life....
I tried to locate a vendor, but didn't get far.
I have the receivers save that stuff when people use it to pack their returns. I also score a lot of egg crate foam pieces too. Quite the perk of working there.
The thin plastic over the denim stuff does break down after sitting for a few years. Makes a real mess, so I strip it off as soon as I get it home now.
Anyone else get PE's email "New Neutrik Connectors Now In Stock" only to find that the new cable end connectors are not in stock but on back-order?
If you need them faster, Amazon also sells them.
InDIYana Event Website
Sweetwater carries neutrik and has free shipping.
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/SpeakOnFXXWS--neutrik-nl4fxx-with-s-speakon-cable-connector
Interesting new speaker offering from DA:
https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-OPAL1-White-Pair-300-4601?quantity=1
It's close to the cost of a CSS 1TDX. Not apples to apples but an overlapping demographic. I just don't see the value in the opal1.
At least $200 overpriced.
I'm sorry, but no it is not.
$800 is a great price for something like this completed so a profit can be made.
Going from driver retail costs...
100 + 100 + 35 + 35 + 35 + 35 + 38 + 38 = 416
The cabinets are prefinished, but supposedly cheaper than the precut knockdown cabs would have been. Even if I say $100 for the mdf, the finish adds likely another $50-100 of cost for most of us to finish a set of cabs.
If you then add in the design time and R&D, that $616 will hit that $800 pretty quickly.
This is a commercial product, and has to make a profit upon sale. I see this way too often that commercial products could be made for much less, but when you figure in the overhead and time being money (labor), you have to include it. Free labor is only applicable if you do it yourself.
I know the 1TDX is close in price. I see the performance is similar in room, save for sensitivity. However, I also see that the OPAL1 is already a finished cabinet, and actually physically smaller. The 1TDX will still require your labor and money to veneer or paint, as well as assembly. The 1TDX has farmed out the labor to the builder.
InDIYana Event Website
Seems like the woofers are DA's response to the Purifi "throw down", and they may be quite good.
No FR measurement or THD shown, which makes me suspicious. Want to see ASR run Klippel on these.
The dude in the video is quite a salesman.
I built a 1TDX pair for a friend a couple of years ago, and they were much better than I had heard from any Dayton drivers, and the crossover was a joy to listen to. Pretty tough to top that.
The dude in the video is Matt P, the designer of the OPAL1.
InDIYana Event Website
Is that the same Matt that has been with Dayton for years? If so, good for him.
I bet they sound great.
Matt has been with PE for as long as I can remember. He was one of the judges at MWAF 2017. He really seems to know the ins and outs of good loudspeaker design. Here is a picture of him in 2017 on the right side of the judging table next to the other two judges (Tom P. and Jerry M.)
Wolf, I have already acknowledged that it is not apples to apples. The 1TDX is still a commercial offering with all of the design work, retail, and R&D costs factored in. The only thing not included is the cabinet. We don't know the quality of the OPAL1 crossover components, considering that the crossover is not touted as a feature the quality is probably meh. I know Matt P. can design a good speaker. I'm not convinced that this 2 way is the best application for the woofer (distortion peek at 1k), and the tweeter has a rocky history. For me, OPAL1 is hard to get excited about. It feels like they forced their "best" components in a box.
Their yet to be released signature series powered speakers have me more intrigued than the OPAL1. Their "reimagined" B52 looks like it is an extremely high value.
Yes, the TDX has a lot of the same costs factored into place, I thought that was understood.
The xover parts are likely stock Dayton parts, or the cost would have been even higher. No illusions there. Matt did a good job with what was used.
I acknowledge the RST checkered past and the rise the E150 has in HD. I won't be using my pair that high. I did not find that they sounded bad though. Did they make a structured "boy band" speaker from their lineup, kinda did. I did not see the "new B52", as I was only briefly in the room.
Not really disagreeing with anything here. Just that it is worth the cost.
InDIYana Event Website
Wolf, how do you feel the Opal1 stacks up against the Bromo?
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/sb-acoustics-bromo-2-way-speaker-kit-pair/